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POLL: Should Moo! Wrapper be Removed from the Whitelist?

There has been significant debate on Reddit and IRC recently on whether the Moo! Wrapper project should continue to be on the Gridcoin Whitelist. Since then, a poll has been conjured into existence by @tomasbrod to allow the community to voice their opinions. Before you vote though, lets take a moment to inform ourselves of what the project actually does.

The aim of Moo! Wrapper is to allow BOINC clients to take part in the RC5 challenge. Effectively, this challenge is the decryption of three messages, one encrypted with a 56-bit key, another with a 64-bit key, and a final one with a 72-bit key.

On October 19, 1997 the correct key was found for the 56-bit secret-key challenge, taking a total of 250 days to locate. This was followed on July 14, 2002 when the 64-bit secret-key challenge was cracked, taking a total of 1757 days. Since December 2002, the Moo! Wrapper project has been working exclusively on the 72-bit, final challenge. The messages follow:

RC5-56: 'The unknown message is: It's time to move to a longer key length' RC5-64: 'The unknown message is: Some things are better left unread' RC5-72: ??? (in progress)


Now, I'd like to point out that this project is not trying to be clever in solving these problems. From the website of the RC5 challenge:

We depend heavily (entirely) on the participation of people like yourself, as we intend to solve this project via the use of brute force, trying every possible key there is.

This brings us to the parallels draw between Moo! Wrapper and Enigma@home, the latter of which decrypts remaining WWII Enigma messages. The Enigma@home project uses a hill climbing algorithm to vastly reduce the time needed to decrypt messages, which is also being actively tested. As such, that project is working on new decryption techniques, and is decrypting messages that could be of actual interest. An argument could certainly be made that Enigma@home is not particularly useful in the grand scheme of things, but at least it has some interesting results?


So what happens when Moo! Wrapper's RC-72 message is solved?

In May 2007, the original creator of the challenge (RSA Labs) announced it would be discontinued. The prize is now privately sponsored and consists of:

$1000 to the winner $1000 to the winner's team (or to the winner if not on a team) $6000 to a non-profit organization chosen by all participants $2000 to distributed.net for building the network and supplying the code

Before you get too excited about that $1000 prize though, here is the project's progress summary:

To be honest, I would rather see that compute put to use somewhere useful.


The poll will be closing February 9th, and is currently standing as reported below by gridcoinstats.eu here:

To vote, fully unlock your wallet. This means that if you have it unlocked for staking, you need to lock your wallet again, and unlock with the 'unlock for staking only' checkbox unchecked. Once unlocked, navigate to your Debug Console and use one of the following commands:

Yes - Remove Moo! Wrapper execute vote whitelist:_remove_moo_wrapper_project Remove_project

No - Keep Moo! Wrapper execute vote whitelist:_remove_moo_wrapper_project Keep_project

Abstain execute vote whitelist:_remove_moo_wrapper_project Abstain

Need More Information execute vote whitelist:_remove_moo_wrapper_project Need_more_information

Note that voting costs just under 0.0025 GRC per vote in network fees.


I run a Steem witness! Please vote for gridcoin.science!


dutch.gif

Comments · 11

  • @mdosev(72)· 3141d

    Thank you for all this information. Gridcoin is truly a thing to follow and learn more about. Just until now I was knowing only the "packaging" or its "shell". Now I'm interested in reading more and learning it's core. I'll keep an eye on your content.

  • @guk(52)· 3142d

    I have posted a rebuttle to the claim this project is not useful here:

    https://steemit.com/gridcoin/@guk/defending-moo-wrapper-and-distributed-net

  • @steemitboard(66)· 3142d

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  • @h202(47)· 3142d

    Stupid question: how are projects actually removed/added to the whitelist? Does the client automatically look at the poll results and act accordingly? Otherwise, wouldn't a single individual have to do it?

  • @m3rcos1ty(49)· 3143d

    Personally whether Moo is dewhitelisted or not will not affect me so I have no 'axe to grind'..

    However, I believe that it will affect many users who do not have GPUs capable of working on other GPU based projects ..

    We do have to cater to users who have older GPUs and it is selfish and unreasonable to override others requirements ..

    Are we looking at selective participation to the detriment of users with older or less powerful systems or are we going to continue to be objective about this and allow full and equal participation?

    Perhaps with a little initiative ( say talking to them ) we can get Moo to create another OpenCl project that the community as a whole considers more useful. That way less fortunate users may also participate in a 'useful' project ..

    "SCIENTIA HUMANA LIBERTAS"

    boinc Courtesy of @joshoeah

  • @parejan(63)· 3143d

    Thanks for the article @dutch.

    Although I'm not a RC-72 fan either, Moo! Wrapper is also trying to find the shortest Golomb Ruler 28 which is really useful.

    Besides, Moo! Wrappper as directly contributed in finding OGR-25, OGR-26 and OGR-27 which are the 3 largest Golomb Rulers known to mankind.

  • @h202(47)· 3143d

    I'm just imagining the sizable compute power that would be redirected to scientifically useful projects if we vote it out. I want to stress, however, that this opinion is based on the fact that Moo! Wrapper has 0.00000 ... (ad infinitum) value from an intellectual point of view. The same is NOT true of other projects like Amicable or PrimeGrid, which, though not application oriented, are still exploring unknown regions of mathematics with the potential to lead to important insights/applications down the road.

    While I'm here I'd also like to point out one of the perks of owning Gridcoin -- increased weight in voting projects in/out of the whitelist!

    Gridcoin = influence over which science is prioritized. Kind of neat.

  • @coin.info(44)· 3143d

    Coins mentioned in post:

    Coin Price (USD) 📈 24h 📉 7d
    ENG Enigma 4.969$ -1.74% -22.16%
    GRC GridCoin 0.111$ 5.79% -33.44%
    RC RussiaCoin 2.780$ 6.27% 13.11%
    STEEM Steem 5.716$ 6.32% -6.73%
  • @jringo(65)· 3143d

    First let me suggest that these conversations are a benefit overall: the more we question what science is and what we are crunching, the more everyone learns! Continuity of Education.

    Now,

    I think we need to build a process to add/remove projects. In the meantime, we can't go around voting to remove projects we think do nothing based on whims. What we want to include in the GRC reward system is a very serious and complex conversation that, if taking place 24/7/365 can distract us from the very real things we need to do. Things that will make this process so much smoother moving forward, such as defined poll parameters and a clearer voting structure and UI and perhaps a treasury system.

    A major part of this conversation is that it seems to have come out of nowhere and the dialogue has been less than constructive. A process lets people prepare for the conversation and formulate points for both sides without getting egos and emotions involved (as much).

    I have read and heard many foundations to some wonderful arguments both for and against Moo! and similar projects.

    For now, I will vote to keep the project. I do this confidently as there are several proposals and serious conversations in development regarding adding and removing projects to/from the whitelist. Additionally, I expect that the conversation around what type of work we want to reward with GRC will grow as we grow as a community and network.

    Interested parties should follow and constructively contribute to:

    https://github.com/gridcoin-community/Gridcoin-Tasks/issues/194

    and

    https://github.com/gridcoin-community/Gridcoin-Tasks/issues/201

  • @gregan(61)· 3143d

    Correct me if I'm wrong but Imo it doesn't fit the general purpose nor any useful or scientific advancement.

    So I voted yes.

  • @najapranata(35)· 3143d

    posting a useful, successful, yes, yes, I have upvote it, in follow @najapranata